The case against hip-hop/ rap
Posted on Sat Jul 21, 2018 8:14 pm

avatar

USAadoresU

Shiroten Performer
Shiroten Performer
First, let me say that Scandal is my all-time favorite band. I admire them for their work, and respect to their fans. It's a huge honor and thrill to their fans that they still do meet & greets. 

That's the reason I'm putting this here. I thought the band's "SCANDAL IN THE HOUSE" was great, but I hope it's the last rap they ever do. 

Rap began on the streets, and as soon as it got noticed,it did a swan-dive straight into the sewer! It was inundated with some of the most disgusting thoughts ever put into words. Every jerk with a microphone had to outdo the other guy. The "thug life" became the only focus, because it out-sold everything else.

Gang activity. Extreme violence to cops, white people, WOMEN (you know, their hoe's?), complete strangers, pretty much anyone who wasn't a "homey". Drug dealing and usage, selling poison to children. Demanding respect, yet spewing hatred and amoral filth.

Every action that served to destroy the black communities and families. That continues to send MANY thousands of young black females and males to prison every year. And the rapper "heroes" made MILLIONS of dollars promoting the evil forces running wild in their own cities!

Then, with the black-on-black violence reaching epic proportions, when the mothers' tears became rivers, they had the unmitigated gall to try the "Stop the violence" crap.
Like spitting on a forest fire they threw gasoline on in the first place!

I was always taught that music is the universal language. That it promotes harmony and shows beauty to all. That is why you will never hear me call hip-hop MUSIC! Oh, and the fact that MUSIC has a MELODY and is usually  accompanied by instruments.

That's my opinion, given by someone watching one element of the destruction of his own country from within.

Back to top Go down

Re: The case against hip-hop/ rap
Posted on Sat Jul 21, 2018 9:27 pm

avatar

tonymiller

International Performer
International Performer
@USAadoresU

I would agree with you about Rap in the USA but Rap from cute Japanese girls is a very different thing.
Check out RHYMEBERRY who I am very fond of.

https://rhymeberry.tokyo/



Back to top Go down

Re: The case against hip-hop/ rap
Posted on Sun Jul 22, 2018 1:35 am

avatar

LK

Indie Artist
Indie Artist
Hmm... this is an interesting topic.

I can see your point @USAadoresU especially on the irony of the "giving and asking respect" thing. It's also rampant in other rap music in other countries. Here in the Philippines, you see 'rappers' whining about not getting their due of respect when in fact the lyrics of their songs are all disrespect and their actions don't really begets respect. Of course, there are exceptions but yeah, in average, this is the truth.

Yet, I still see rap and hip-hop as music all the same, and at that, beautiful ones. I think their music is intrinsically 'competitive' so basically they sort of awaken the wild in us. They basically stimulate us to spit words and show those moves. I really appreciate rap/hip-hop whose lyrics are beautifully constructed and are uplifting. There are lots of them if we'll just look closer. And I really hate those with nonsense and negative messages. I never really enjoyed listening to the music of those top-charting rappers in the US and I can't honestly fathom why would a lot a people listen to them.

Also, I disagree with SCANDAL stopping at SCANDAL in the House. In fact, I do wish they incorporate rap to some of their songs in the future! I don't know if you watched Dobondobondo no theme or Dobondobondo Dungeon... Mami and Tomi are so kawaii and cool rapping on those vids! Besides, being SCANDAL, I do believe their rap, if ever they do continue doing it, will have sweet, positive messages.

So yeah, break it down yo.  Dance

Back to top Go down

Re: The case against hip-hop/ rap
Posted on Sun Jul 22, 2018 3:10 am

avatar

Don Dio

Mainstream Artist
Mainstream Artist
I am a self-confessed rock snob (and, on this topic, a grumpy old man).  If the song doesn’t contain real instruments being played by real individuals, then I don’t consider it music.  It’s just electronic noise.  Negative social issues aside (already raised), I see rap as annoying an “art form” as electronica, techno and all that dj-spinning nonsense that seems popular these days.  

One of the few times I was able to tolerate it was when LL Cool J did an episode of “MTV Unplugged” and he had a backing band.  That actually sounded pretty cool.  And of course, I can appreciate what the Scandal ladies have done because I like them and think it’s funny.  But I rarely ever make a conscious effort to listen to “Scandal In The House,” “Cherry Jam,” or any of the others.

Back to top Go down

Re: The case against hip-hop/ rap
Posted on Sun Jul 22, 2018 8:28 am

avatar

akko_

Caless Student
Caless Student
@USAadoresU
I'm the kind of person that listens to everything from Kyary Pamyu Pamyu to Meshuggah, so I've tried to learn to love the vast spectrum that music offers.  I do agree that many rappers write lyrics about the things you mentioned, and the way we perceive the content of their lyrics is purely subjective. I think it's up to the listener to discern what they want to listen to.  It's tough to throw a blanket statement onto an entire genre of music because of certain artists or perceptions thereof.  I've been listening to hip hop for a few years now, and just fell in love with the more quirky and esoteric lyricists like Milo, Open Mike Eagle, Aesop Rock, and most recently, BROCKHAMPTON.  

The landscape of hip hop has changed drastically over the last few years, the way beats are made, the overall sound, and most importantly in this case, the content.  Whether or not you consider it music is up to you. Maybe try listening to an album from the early 2000s like Madvillain's Madvillainy that displays a more aloof side of songwriting with clever lyricism, interesting flow cadences, and most importantly subject matter far from the norm.  Madlib, who made the beats for Madvillain plays a lot of the samples in his beats himself, as he plays many, many instruments.  While definitely not the majority, true instrumentalists in Hip Hop are out there.  

Another example would be Logic's Under Pressure from 2014, while Logic does have his moments of trying to prove himself or be competitive, songs like Gang Related and the album's titular track are a nice contrast to the violent tendencies of prior eras of hip hop. In Gang Related, Logic talks about his brother's experiences in gangs and how he never wants Logic (referred to as Bobby in the song) to ever follow in his footsteps.    

As far as its effect on society, yes, it has had impact on what happens in certain parts of the country, but in the same way, hip hop was created as a way to escape their surroundings and create means to vent. In a way, I kind of see it as their way of exposing the harsh realities that they may have to overcome, and once they do, some like to flaunt it.

I'm not trying to change your mind as far as whether or not it's music, I just wanted to bring light to other artists that actually create art and inspire people.  I've always been the type to prefer the more wordy, lyric-driven hip hop artists over more of the gangsta rap artists of old.  Different strokes for different folks i suppose.

Back to top Go down

Re: The case against hip-hop/ rap
Posted on Sun Jul 22, 2018 1:05 pm

avatar

peachclub

Indie Artist
Indie Artist
It's good that you shard your opinion about SCANDAL's music and how you think would make their work more enjoyable, but I can't quite agree with your opinion and how you generalize the genre of Hip-Hop itself. 

It is a valid point and I do agree with you that a lot of Hip-Hop musicians use violent languages for their songs, but I can't say that violent word choices aren't found in other types of music. Some sub-genres of Metal such as Black Metal or Death Metal, or Grindcore music really have songs that have more shocking lyrics than Hip-Hop songs. 

And just to add another point to the violent lyrics part, not all Hip-Hop music promotes guns, sex, drug, or violence. If you really search through Hip-Hop music, it would not be difficult to find non violence promoting Hip-Hop songs, and artists. Comedy Hip-Hop could be an example of a sub-genre of Hip-Hop that does not particularly promote violence. Some known artist of that sub-genre could be Lil Dicky and Jon Lajoie. They do include sexual jokes in their songs but no way used to promote sexual crimes but just as a comedic factor. Just like so not all songs with the inappropriate theme in it are there to promote it. 

A song by Eminem called "Stan" has part of lyrics where the character called Stan ties up his pregnant girlfriend in the trunk and drives the car off the bridge killing all 3 of them. It is a pretty violent, and gory lyrics when seeing but the song is actually to tell his fans do not do all the stupid things that Stan had done and when liking an artist or their work, do not literally take them and imitate them. The violent lyrics are not used only to promote it but with context, it could be to there to try and help prevent it. 

But hey, violent lyrics are all ok, it's up to the artist to decide whatever they want to put in their work. Some might say that the violent lyrics would trigger the listeners, like how Marilyn Manson had been blamed for the Columbine High School Shooting, and video games blamed for violent crimes. But we all know that that's not true, even if Hip-Hop didn't exist, the ones who would be "motivated" by Hip-Hop would find other content to be "motivated", and that new type of content they found would be blamed. 

About "Hip-Hop having no melody so it is not considered as music" part I have to disagree on that. Buddy Rich playing a drum solo for 5 minutes could be considered music, but does it have any melody? No. And plus Hip-Hop beats that rappers rap upon are not just some random guy with no musical talent beating on a drum machine, but rather is created by decent musicians and it consists of different (probably all computer generated) instruments. Music is not just about melody, but also about harmony, rhythm and all the other stuff, it's just that many other types of songs focus or at least the most attention grabbing component is melody. With the case of Hip-Hop, it is the rhythm that is intensified. So it is not fair to not classify Hip-Hop as music because it doesn't really have a melody. 

Confirmation bias, a concept in psychology that refers to when people are finding evidence that would only confirm the idea that they have and not bother to find evidence that would contradict to their idea. I believe that is what you are facing. While having a thought in your mind that says Hip-Hop is bad you did not bother to find any nonviolent, meaningful Hip-Hop songs, therefore, leading you to an incomplete conclusion.

Back to top Go down

Re: The case against hip-hop/ rap
Posted on Sun Jul 22, 2018 1:48 pm

avatar

LK

Indie Artist
Indie Artist
@peachclub
I was having a deja vu while reading your last three paragraphs. I swear I read similar thoughts somewhere. But I'm not accusing you or anything, that deja vu was stronger than normal ones and so I shared, so no worries. 

Back to top Go down

Re: The case against hip-hop/ rap
Posted on Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:33 pm

avatar

peachclub

Indie Artist
Indie Artist
@LK 

Probably because all those Hip-Hop head defending that Hip-Hop is not that bad all have the same logic, including me. 

I'm not a die-hard Hip-Hop guy though. I just listen to them very occasionally. Contradicting the points I made above, I listen to them just because I like the nasty lyrics.  Hehee Hehee

Back to top Go down

Re: The case against hip-hop/ rap
Posted on Wed Jul 25, 2018 11:21 am

avatar

LK

Indie Artist
Indie Artist
@peachclub
Most of us do sometimes.  Common

Back to top Go down

Re: The case against hip-hop/ rap
Posted on Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:44 am

avatar

USAadoresU

Shiroten Performer
Shiroten Performer
Well, after thinking about it at length, I guess if (c)rap isn't going away, it would be best if someone gave it some redeeming value. I can't think of anyone more suited than the ladies of SCANDAL.

It's been a plague in the U.S., only serving to turn people away from any good they might accomplish. I love my home, as I'm sure you do yours. Many other forces also seek to tear down societies, this is just a particularly bad influence on our youth and, in effect, the future.

I never intended to disparage SCANDAL, or any of their work. There isn't a sweeter, more hard-working group in the business and I support them 100%.

Back to top Go down